Talk:Weinachts Oratorium (Christmas Oratorio), BWV 248 (Johann Sebastian Bach)

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Error list

Some of these are variations between different editions. I have consulted the vocal scores Bärenreiter 5014a [BÄR], Carus 31.246/53 [CAR], Peters 38 [PET], and a bass voice of Breitkopf & Härtel [B&H].

#1. Coro „Jauchzet, frohlocket, auf, preiset die Tage”

All voices, starting with tenor, bar 50: the third beat (the 3/32 note B) has a trill (tr). This holds for all occurrences of this motif.

Bars 36-38. Tenor should be an octave lower.
Bar 58. Tenor: B sharp should be C natural.
Bar 81. Tenor C sharp should be an octave higher.
Bars 136-137. Tenor should be an octave higher.
Bar 137. Upper three voices should have fermata.

#9. Choral „Ach mein herzliebes Jesulein!”

The penultimate word is ver-ges-se, not ver-ges-sen.

Pothárn edition: in m12, tenor part, quarter note on syllable "ges" of "vergesse": should that be pitch 'e' rather than 'd'? (in Lilypond file, line 102, a4 g8( fis) e4 a'8( g) rather than a4 g8( fis) d4 a'8( g) ? Tahattawan (talk) 01:03, 2 January 2015 (UTC)

Not only my edition, but also Michael Dreschler's edition has a "d". I now consulted two 19th editions available from IMSLP (they were also my sources), Breitkopf und Härtel Klavierauszug V.A. 13 and Edition Peters Vocal Score No.38 8795. Both sources have d. So unless a newer critical edition has an e instead of d, the d is correct. Imruska (talk) 12:18, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

IMSLP also has Bach's (or his copyist's) autograph score. It has "d". Imruska (talk) 12:45, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

Thanks, this is great. We were using 1999 New Novello Edition in English, by Neil Jenkins, which has "e" there. So that could be a typo? His intro says "The musical text of this edition is derived from the Urtext der Neuen Bach-Ausgabe (1960). Heed has also been taken of the original versions of arias and choruses derived from BWV 213, 214, and 215." thank you! Tahattawan (talk) 16:19, 3 April 2015 (UTC)

#17. Choral „Schaut hin! dort liegt im finstern Stall”

Bar 4, tenor. Last note is Bb, not A# (typographical error).

#23. Choral „Wir singen dir in deinem Heer”

Typographical issue in Bars 6-7 (and less importantly in bar 13): the 9/8 rest is difficult to parse. It would be better to group it as 3/8+6/8 and 6/8+3/8.

#28. Choral „Dies hat er alles uns getan”

This is probably only a typo in the vocal score [BÄR]: Bar 9, bass: The text is "keit Ky-rie-e-" with one syllable per 1/4. All other editions have "keit Ky-ri-e-".

#26. Coro „Lasset uns nun gehen gen Bethlehem”

Pothárn edition: in m16, tenor part, last note on syllable "te" of "Geschichte", should that be pitch 'c' (same pitch as previous note) instead of 'f'? (Lilypond file, line 138: cis8 h cis4. cis,8 rather than cis8 h cis4. fis,8 ? ) Tahattawan (talk) 01:02, 2 January 2015 (UTC)

I can only repeat what I wrote also to No.9. Both Breitkopf und Härtel and Edition Peters have what I (and Michael Dreschler) wrote, in this case a fis (F sharp). So unless a new critical edition here has a cis (C sharp), fis (F sharp) is correct. I unfortunately have no access to newer editions, but I am ready to correct the score if the 19th editions are faulty. Imruska (talk) 12:26, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

I checked Bach's autograph score on IMSLP. It has fis (F sharp). Imruska (talk) 12:45, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

Right, same as #9 thread... here it's "c" in the Neil Jenkins 1999 New Novello Edition, which in his intro he says is derived from Urtext der NBA. thanks Tahattawan (talk) 16:27, 3 April 2015 (UTC)

#36. Coro „Fallt mit Danken, fallt mit Loben”

Bar 50, bass. The first two 1/8 notes (F - Eb) should be replaced by a 1/4 note Eb. (The tr is correct; it remains on the first note.)

Bar 190, bass. Similarly, the first two 1/8 notes (F - E) should be replaced by a 1/4 note E. (The tr is correct; it remains on the first note.) All editions I have consulted [BÄR],[CAR],[PET],[B&H] agree on this.

Bar 145, bass. The 5th 1/16 note should be G# not G. (Remove the natural sign)

#42. Choral „Jesus richte mein Beginnen”

Bar 17 (the last bar before the repetition sign) is only played the first time, and not repeated.

#43. Coro „Ehre sei dir, Gott, gesungen”

Bar 24, all voices: first note (Gott) is 1/8, not 1/4. (All editions I have consulted [BÄR],[CAR],[PET],[B&H] agree on this.)

Bar 98-99. The bar line between the bars should be shifted 1/4 to the left. (and the apostrophe in bereit' is missing in the tenor voice.)

#45. Coro „Wo ist der neugeborne König der Jüden"

Variations of text. Juden is the modern form, Jüden is obsolete (and probably the original version). [PET] and [B&H] have Juden; [BÄR] and [CAR] have Jüden.

Bar 2, alto. Gb should be G.

Bar 9, alto. Gb should be G.

#54. Chorus „Herr, wenn die stolzen Feinde schnauben”

Bar 223-224, bass. The last three notes of bar 223 and the first note of bar 224 are D-C#-B-A. This agrees with [B&H] and [PET]. [CAR] and [BÄR] have a variation in which this passage is a third lower: B-A-G-F#.

Bar 145, tenor. 2nd not should be C#, not C. (Remove the natural sign.)

Variations of text. Hilfe is the modern form of the noun help, Hülfe is an obsolete form. (... nach deiner Macht und Hilfe/Hülfe sehn.) [B&H] has Hilfe; [PET], [BÄR] and [CAR] have Hülfe.

#64. Choral „Nun seid ihr wohl gerochen”

The first bar is not repeated; the repetition starts with bar 2. (And there is 1/8 upbeat before bar 1.)

--Rote 09:19, 8 January 2009 (UTC)

Cantata nr. 3 - comparison with other score editions

Edition #5516 was compared with Peters edition nr. 38, then any difference found was cross-checked against the Breitkopf & Härtel edition V.A.13, and with the Bach-Gesellschaft Ausgabe (BGA). Such alternative editions are all available at IMSLP, and they are considered as reference editions herein. The comparison is limited to notes of the choral parts (no comparison was performed on lyrics). The following differences were identified:

Nr. 24

Alto, bar 91: the last note is E in all reference editions, F in #5516.


Nr. 26

Tenor, bar 24: the first note is B# in all reference editions, A# in #5516.


Nr. 33

Soprano, bar 6: the second note is F(#) in in all reference editions, C(#) in #5516.
Alto, bar 10: the second note is G natural in all reference editions, G(#) in #5516 (missing natural sign).


The choir training aids available at Choralia are consistent with the reference editions. Comparison made by Max a.k.a. Choralia 10:18, 7 August 2009 (UTC).

#3 (12). Choral „Brich an, o schönes Morgenlicht” Typo in Text

right: Satan wrong: Saten

--Justyjusty123 11:57, 24 December 2010 (UTC)